|
|
Photography Forums
|
Author
|
|
|
This Topic has 3 pages :
[
1
|
2
|
3
| Next
]
|
|
|
CompositionMan
|
 |
Date Posted:
Mar/09/2005 5:21 AM
|
|
I found in a local art store a 10 tone black and white tone
Grey Scale and Value Finder. The tones range from black to
white - like Ansel Adams systtem. It works in conjuntion
with a colour wheel in painting.
I have used it for matching mid tones in an image on the
P C screen to the Value 5 of the Grey Scale and the results
have been very good.
This card is small and can be kept in ones shirt pocket
in plastic bag to keep it clean.
It is put out by the COLOR WHEEL COMPANY. No web site is shown
but you could try COLOUR WHEEL COMPANY to check for one.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
|
|
Bratt247
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/09/2005 6:09 AM
|
|
Is THIS what you are talking about?
It seems that it could really come in handy!
Bob S.
-------------------------
Philosophy of Life: If all else fails - read the manual!
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/09/2005 6:58 AM
|
|
Bob!
You just won top prize in the PIN BALL LOTTERY! Yes, that is it.
Below is a sample image I did using it. You can notice a marked improvement over an earlier copy I put in the SUBJECTS area.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/09/2005 07:04:53
|
|
swanseamale47
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/09/2005 10:39 AM
|
|
Norm, on my monitor Ann has a magenta cast (see pic) how does it look on your monitor? Wayne
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/09/2005 10:59 AM
|
|
Wayne
I do have a very slightly warm cast on the shadow area of the face, but the paper and everything else is clean. The white paper is very clean. The top left of the paper has a very small warmish cast - but nothing that you describe.
The scene was done with a shadeless tri light before I started the grey card test of last weekend - hence the warmish tones but not to the extent you show.
I would suggest maybe a slight check of your screen settings or your art programme settings - I am sorry to see you have that problem. I hope this helps.
I did the following image the same as the one with the white paper. Anne's blue jacket was set to the density of Value 5 on the Grey Scale as I worked it up. Do you have any problems with color on this one? On my screen, it is as clear as can be right through. It was taken as a test at our Senior's Centre.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/09/2005 14:18:19
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 12:27 AM
|
|
Norm, I'm sorry to say that I also have a magenta cast in the first picture and a slight yellow/green in the second.
How did you calibrate your monitor and what icc profile are you using in uploading images (I calibrate mine with Adobe Gamma and use Adobe1998 profile, so the problem could be there)
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
swanseamale47
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 12:47 AM
|
|
Yes Norm, I can see the yellow/green that Dimitri mentions as well, my monitor is checked around every two months and I also use 3 other computers for my photos (another in the house and 2 at work) and haven't noticed any problems, it may be that the posting on the web may affect the colours? not sure about that. Wayne
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 4:12 AM
|
|
Wayne, Dimitri
I went over the monitor and checked it with the buttons on the bottom of the screen. I have no problems with colours. I did find that when I moverd the colour select from 9300K it gave me different colours like a pinkish shade and a blue-greenish shade.
As long as it stays at 9300K I am fine and I have had no one local say I have had a colour cast when I send any material. Some say their monitors may be sllightly less sharp or something (maybe age here), I do not know, but no colour cast.
I have a Macbeth Colour Checker on my system and the colours all come out clean. I ddouble checked my grey on the colour checker with the grey card and my grey scale card and they match with no colour cast.
I regret that I do not know what is causing the problem of the colour cast. I will enquire further if any locals are having a problem. It may be then that the posting on the net is causing it - especially going to Europe.
As for uploading - I just do it in the normal way - I use the browse button on the screen below where I am typing and then press upload button. Maybe I need to make the images a certain size - I keep them at around 100 to 150 for dial up people, also they are JPG files and not some other extension.
I will ask if anyone else knows what I can check. As I said, I have had no one local say there is a colour cast.
I have just made a change in my dpi and pixels - let me know if this helps.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/10/2005 04:42:04
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 4:43 AM
|
|
Wayne, Dimitri
Here is the other scene with a dpi and pixel change. Let me know if this makes any difference.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/10/2005 06:30:34
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 6:36 AM
|
|
Sorry Norm, still same problem. Must be some profile mismatch since haven't seen the same problem with any of your photos.
Will check both this evening at hoem with another monitor and setup to see if I can figure out why I see them this way.
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 7:28 AM
|
|
Dimitri Wayne
Following is my Macbeth Colour Scale. I found it on the web and use it to
set my screen to the colours as best I can.
Advise me if this has any colour cast. It is at 72 dpi and 720 by 480 pixels - my normal size.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 11:35 AM
|
|
Norm, no color casts in GMcB. All colors looks natural.
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/10/2005 11:52 AM
|
|
Dimitri
I wish I knew waht caused the problems in the other images. You say there is not any color casts in the colour chart, then why did the others have it?
One earlier image has a clear subject and the off colour lighting in the background only due to tube lighting in our Seniors Centre. The white and blue of the subject's clothes are very accurate. The other one was clear all the way through.
At least the colour chart was good.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/10/2005 14:23:09
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 12:04 AM
|
|
Norm here is an attempt to color correct one of the pictures. All I did was define the white point in Photoshop.
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 1:37 AM
|
|
Dimitri
Your corrected copy is a perfect match to my copy here that I sent first.
This is why I do not know why your original copy came out the way it did.
The second copy is slightly darker than that around the face - yet it
was very accurate in colurs in the blue jacket, white blouse collar and all.
Well done in any case. I used INFRANVIEW when I did those copies, but I
feel that should not have a bearing on it. I have since switched to GIMP to finish my work with my GREY SCALE card.
Following is an image using GIMP. It is a nothing image, but it shows how accurate I was able to bring out the 10 points on the card. I tried to match the card image on the P C screen with the card in real life - and I did. let me know if there is any colour cast.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 2:33 AM
|
|
Norm, I think I know what the problem is. IrfanView uses a different color gamut and there is some discrepancy in the way it shows things. I don't know what makes it (and ACDSee) to do this but sometimes under some PC configutations they do show colors in a totatly different way. It could be one of those things. (BTW the images you uploaded had the Adobe1998 profile)
The new one is confusing me. There is a slight magenta cast, but the gray scale is OK, so I suppose it's the cast from the lighting in the room. To confirm it I opened it in PS and did some adjustments. All of them showed that the color rendition is OK but there is a cast from the room illumination.
(This image is sRGB)
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 4:59 AM
|
|
Dimitri
I do not know what to suggest to correct the colour problems if both INFRANVIEW AND GIMP cause them.
I did use flash on the GREY SCALE shot although it seemed to be about the same level as the room lights which were on. Again, though, I have not had others say there has been a colour cast come over to them.
On SONYCAM.COM/FORUMS where I have posted images from both programmes no one has said anything about colour casts. Try SONYCAM.COM/FORUMS and go to the area called PHOTONOOK - 3716 South and see if any of my images (the same as I posted here) give any colour cast to you.
Do you have any ideas why people have the problem over there and not over here? I say this as I use both programmes here at times. Is the European internet system different in some way in how they receive and distribute certain colour packets we send from America over the system?
One friend I sent the last GREY CARD image to said how surprised he was at the improved accuracy of tones but said nothing of any colour casts. This gives me the idea that the screen and system are working well.
On the camera, I wonder - should I go from 0 EV setting to something in the plus range? Is it the camera not giving out enough light even when the batteries are fresh? It is not that old 2001 ow 02 year model.
Another question I have is - are you on broadband/high speed or dial up service over there? I am on broadband and I wonder if broadband has difficulty sending colours accurately to dial up people in Europe? Perhaps you or someone could help me on that from Europe.
Maybe this is why Wayne and you are having the same problems with certain images - or it could be that my flash needs more power to go above the liaght level of the house lights.
I will continue thinking of ideas to solve the question.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
Message edited by: CompositionMan on 03/11/2005 05:02:03
|
|
Dimitri
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 5:18 AM
|
|
Norm, I'm somewhat confused. Are we talking about a picture from a videocamera or a stills camera. If it is from a videocamera then it might be some mixup between the PAL/NTSC formats.
If it is a stills camera then it could be some incompatibility between oyr viewers. However I did not see any color casts in any of your pictures up to now, so I don't know what could be causing this.
What I'll do is to post a composite of a "before" and an "after" pictures so you can tell me if you can see the difference. Maybe we can sort it out 
-------------------------
Athens, Greece
---------------
Too many Chiefs, not enough Indians....
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 6:42 AM
|
|
Dimitri
I see the difference. I also am using a SONY P 72 still camera. Many days have passed since I posted anything from my videocam.
Now, I see the difference is much slighter that I first thought. In my scene of Anne and the paper - I used a tri-light - shadeless - as my light source - no flash at all here. I used the 150 (top) setting on the lamp which is bright - but low in terms of colour accuracy. When I tried to correct for it, I guess I did not go far enough in my P C art programmes. I will say that. It is the fact that I wanted to try a warmish type of image to see what would come from it - I guess I should have taken a normal imagae instead.
The other scenes are also taken the with the P 72. In those I used flash on the programme mode settings - by what the menu shows for different lighting situations. Maybe for those I should have used all automatic settings instead.
Again, no one seems to say anything about the slightly warmish cast on the image with the paper or any objectionalbe colour on the other images. I have loaded a copy of PS ELEMENTS Version 2 and will try a shot through there to see if the problems have been the programmes or what. If I use ADOBE programmes maybe that will cure the problem.
What does interest me is - you said my earlier images are not colour casted. Maybe it was just these ones where I was trying a different setting that put my images off on some monitors.
I will be working to find out if there is any other explanation and will post my findings. In the meantime, I will go back to all automatic settings and use PS ELEMENTS to see if that makes any difference. If the images bothered others I wish they said so - but when I checked SONY -for example - I saw no coloure cast when I opened the link.
Fair enough?
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
|
|
CompositionMan
|
|
Date Posted:
Mar/11/2005 7:09 AM
|
|
Dimitri
I just did an image through ADOBE ELEMENTS V 2. I used all automatic everything on the camera and NO HOUSELIGHTS - only flash on the camera.
Is there any colour cast on this one? I should think when you said that my uploads were ADOBE, this one should be accurate. I still like to use my GREY SCALE to match my tones, but I will be leaving out the house lights to see if that helps.
Advise me if any colour casts come over to you.
-------------------------
Norm Dunne - Lover of the Old Masters and their work
|
|
|
This Topic has 3 pages :
[
1
|
2
|
3
| Next
]
|
|
|
|
|
